Little Green Footballs

Monday, May 19, 2008

Charles Johnson's child abuse

According to Charles Johnson, if your father was a Muslim then you're born a Muslim.

According to Charles Johnson, if you're born a Muslim then you're always a Muslim.

According to Charles Johnson, if you're a Muslim then you're an ally of Osama bin Laden.

No kidding. CJ doesn't even try to hide what he thinks in this one.

Nice to see the plump defender of the West dispense with reason and Enlightenment values and choose instead a line of thinking that would make the looniest mufti proud.

12 comments:

Tex Taylor said...

Yeah, yeah, yeah. All Muslims are evil, peace be upon us, and the Sphinxter is my best friend.

Now, when are you articulate, lefty loons going to applaud the U.N. for bringing due diligence from none other than the most appropriately named Doudou Diene about us racist Americans? Gee, how wonderful the timing. Now why do you think that might be? Right before the elections too! I wonder who the United Nations wants sitting in the Whitehouse?

You think Obambi can make it to the council with those bastions if international freedom like Algeria, Azerbaijan, Cameroon, Cuba, China, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Tunisia, and Russia?

And y'all ever notice how you guys almost to a 'T' are right in lockstep with that lovingly inept U.N. crowd? We haven't had good old fashioned blame Israel thread in months.

Come on, you guys and gals!

Anonymous said...

According to Charles Johnson, if your father was a Muslim then you're born a Muslim.

Uhhh... No. According to a sizable body of Islamic tradition to which CJ is making reference.

According to Charles Johnson, if you're born a Muslim then you're always a Muslim.

Sorry, wrong again. Once again, CJ is discussing certain lines of Islamic thought which consider anyone who leaves Islam to be an apostate. You do recognize the difference between stating one's own opinions and discussing the opinions of others? The question, then, is how such Muslims would react to an Obama presidency. And if you actually read the article you link to, you would see the NYT is asking the question, too, not just CJ. (Frankly, I don't think the Muslim world[s] would make much of it, but it's still an interesting question.)

According to Charles Johnson, if you're a Muslim then you're an ally of Osama bin Laden.

Well, after manufacturing or misinterpreting the evidence for your first two "according to's," it's no surprise you'd totally fabricate this one. CJ does not mention OBL in the post to which you link, and he adds that he doesn't expect Obama's "apostasy" to be an issue at all for him in US-Muslim relations (assuming he's elected.)

Amazing. This is your first post in over a week, and you manage to hit your chin on every rung of the stupid ladder on you fall to the bottom.

Rico

The Sphinx said...

Doesn't it strike you as weird that CJ, who has embarked on a rabid and frantic smear campaign against Barack Obama suddenly apparently cares so much about his safety from the eeevil Muslim world who will be hell-bent on killing him?

Probably can't decide on who to hate more..

Anonymous said...

Sphinx:

I would submit that CJ's actual question is how US foreign policy with the Islamic world would be affected if the US had an "apostate" President. As for the "smearing," it should be noted that Obama himself apparently has been less than straightforward about his Muslim roots -- no doubt because he recognizes that it would be a political liability. I would hope that the major candidates (McCain and (for at least another month(?) Clinton) would avoid making an issue of it, as it could not but come off as bigoted.

As CJ himself acknowledges, there probably wouldn't be much of an effect at all. Further speculation about CJ's motives or the ramifications of Obama's "Muslim" childhood don't much interest me right now, and besides I have to get to work.

Rico

Tex Taylor said...

Sphinx,

I have a fair question for you. Two actually. I really would value your honest opinion because I think it gets to the heart of the differences between your people and mine.

As a Muslim, and I am going to assume you really are sincere in your faith, do you think countries like Iran, Yemen, Algeria, and the like evil?

Note that I am not talking about the average Joe like you or me trying to get along best they can, raise their children, help their family and friends, do right by their God.

I'm talking about the respective political unit, the objectives, the mission of the above governments and its spiritual leaders.

Can you honestly tell me that you think in their heart of hearts, the leaders of the above have the best interests of its own citizens on the agenda?

See, I don't think most Muslims evil, nor do I think Charles Johnson, or LGF members, or most American citizens think most Muslims evil either. I honestly believe many Muslims are much like me in their wishes and hopes, really only victims of their own leader's foibles.

So my second question to you is: as a devout Muslim, being young and bright, why is it you have such difficulty in admitting the faults of the world you live in?

The Sphinx said...

"As a Muslim, and I am going to assume you really are sincere in your faith, do you think countries like Iran, Yemen, Algeria, and the like evil?"

I personally don't believe in the idea of an "evil country". There are only corrupt governments officials, evil militias, malicious individuals but evil countries? No. Also in every corrupt government there are still parts of it that are not, so I don't stick to sweeping generalizations of the entire establishment.

By that standard, I do not consider Israel to be an evil country, and I don't know about the governments policy towards its citizens, but I do have my problems with its (and the army's) policy towards Arabs.

Speaking about Iran, it's sometimes good to see how things are really going on inside the country amongst the regular people. If you have an hour and a half to spare, you can watch this documentary.

"Can you honestly tell me that you think in their heart of hearts, the leaders of the above have the best interests of its own citizens on the agenda?"

The problem is, I'm not too well informed about the interior policy of said Governments, and haven't been to any of those countries. I've only heard so far that Iranians have similar problems with their government as Egyptians do, and I can say with a sound conscience that many Egyptian leaders do NOT have the best interests of its citizens on the agenda. So in my semi-ignorance, I'll stick to being wary of the others before jumping to conclusions.

"See, I don't think most Muslims evil, nor do I think Charles Johnson, or LGF members, or most American citizens think most Muslims evil either. I honestly believe many Muslims are much like me in their wishes and hopes, really only victims of their own leader's foibles."

I'm glad you see it that way. Out of CJ's perspective though, he still seems to view the Muslim world as one big monolith that tends to be more evil than not, as reflected in this (rather recent) post of his (You might want to copy and paste the link). Not even willing to ask why he's not hearing about Muslims who reject extremism, though he probably never even cared to search for such people.

"So my second question to you is: as a devout Muslim, being young and bright, why is it you have such difficulty in admitting the faults of the world you live in?"

If we had about 3 hours together in one room I could go on an endless tirade on what I find wrong with the Egyptian society alone. You just haven't had the opportunity yet.
I still value my society and culture, and was just speaking to a bunch of German friends about this matter today, but there are some faults that I am very well aware of and won't be afraid to talk about. Not just me, but just about everyone I know who still lives there. That includes a lot of people.

Thanks for listening by the way.

Tex Taylor said...

Sphinx,

For as much crap as I've given you over the last months, I probably didn't deserve as frank as a response as you gave. Your response was not only eloquent but appreciated. And I wish I had framed that question differently about "country" because I believe you to be right - the term is too broad.

You might be surprised that although I am surely defined as a "wingnut", I too have problems with much of our American government, and not just Dimocrats.

Interestingly, before I left Corporate America (and I suppose I was a benefactor, "a have" if you will of capitalism), what drove me away was the insatiable greed of many of my superiors, the injustice I witnessed, some by people calling themselves Christian, and the fact that I was really beginning to question my own purpose.

America surely has its own set of problems because just like Egypt it too is made up of fallible people. It is possible that perhaps many of us (Americans), myself included, have become one-sided and now are itching for a fight.

However, if nineteen men, calling themselves Christian, had screamed "Come to Jesus" while flying your completely innocent citizens into two skyscrapers and killed 3,000 of your own, can you tell me honestly that you would be willing just to forgive and forget? I don't need to remind you there was a long history of bad blood long before 9/11 which was just the final straw.

Sphinx, I do not believe every Jew an angel nor Muslim a devil. I suppose my views colored because of past grievances in my dealings with some Muslims. I am a strong supporter of Israel's right to exist in peace and will continue to support the cause. I am sure there are many faults on both sides in the ongoing feud and I conveniently tune guys like you out.

I appreciate your honesty in your last answer and have never considered you the enemy. Though we are worlds apart not only demographically but in basic tenets, I really think I would consider you an honorable person. In some ways, that last answer of yours earned my respect. Perhaps instead of seeking differences, we could one day work toward a common good.

I will tell you this. IMO, in order to save the world you know, young men like you are going to have to work very hard at great risk to change hearts; to at least convince the majority of your people to show an uncommon bravery facing off against unreasonable, ruthless killers. I do not believe the Jews or Americans to be your real enemy.

Anonymous said...

"no doubt because he recognizes that it would be a political liability"

Why Americans like CJ cares if Obama was born a muslim or not, shouldn't they wish for more Muslims to leave Islam?

I'm myself ex-muslim and I find it very offensive what CJ and his lizards are writing recently about Obama's religion. Islam is just a religion you can leave it. bad religion? Yes. Is it a race you cannot throw it away? No, you can throw it away regardless of what Muslims think.

The Sphinx said...

Tex, I'm on the verge of passing my 40th hour without any sleep, so bear with me if this post shows any signs of delirium.

This proves that we really can get along if we wanted to. I also agree that one should always try to work toward a common good. After all, we're all humans living on a large rock with practically the same basic needs. From a painfully idealistic point of view, there's no real reason why people should not be able to achieve this and just get along.

Which is why I prefer such discussions much more over endless flame wars that lead to nothing but just a huge waste of time and lots of anger over too small issues.

Before I drop off, I'd like to address two points you mentioned though:

"However, if nineteen men, calling themselves Christian, had screamed "Come to Jesus" while flying your completely innocent citizens into two skyscrapers and killed 3,000 of your own, can you tell me honestly that you would be willing just to forgive and forget? I don't need to remind you there was a long history of bad blood long before 9/11 which was just the final straw."

Needless to say, and to put it extremely lightly, I wouldn't be happy at all. I do understand where your anger comes from, but this wouldn't tarnish any of the many friendships with Christians that I already have (Two of my best friends through my younger years being Christian), because as the Quran puts it:

(..) No soul benefits except from its own works, and no soul bears the burden [of sin] of another. Ultimately, you return to your Lord, then He informs you regarding all your disputes." (6:164)

I'm a rather forgiving person, and even such a hypothetical incident would not shake my belief that Jesus was in fact sent by God as a messenger and symbol of mercy to humanity. Completely regardless of who claims to represent him.

"I do not believe the Jews or Americans to be your real enemy."

I don't either. And directing criticism towards Zionist policies against Arabs or the Bush administration's policy in the Middle East has nothing to do with any animosity against Americans or Jews in general. In fact, just as I was saying before, whoever is responsible for such actions makes up a small margin of the people who happen to be American or Jewish, and as for the rest.. Well, I'll just refer to the same Quranic verse I just quoted.

So even though you might not agree with me on my criticism, we can certainly agree that generalizing the criticism to ALL Americans/Jews/Israelis/whatever is not just counter-productive, it's also stupid.

I appreciate the civil discussion a lot Tex, and maybe our differences really aren't as huge as we both assumed at first. But right now I'm off to drop dead. Consider I sent you a proverbial handshake from across the pond

Lex said...

Sphinx, I sure hope you've gotten some sleep by the time you read this! You're killing me!

Tex, I'm glad you got to see this side of Sphinx, though he's shown it before around you. He's just a very logical and understanding person and very forgiving. I'll admit too, I'm glad that you asked the question regarding 9/11. This has been a hard thing for many Americans to grapple with, and I don't think it should just be swept under the rug. I obviously don't agree with CJohnson's cherry-picking posting on Muslims goings on (and hatred of Ron Paul, occasional chumming the waters of his lizards with rather unrelated far-right posts), nor with many of his commenters' frequent ventings.

Your point is relevant, for all that it strikes those in other countries as odd, 9/11 was the introduction to Islam for a large number of Americans, which is why Americans have had a hard time dealing with feelings toward Islam and Muslims. I agree though Tex, most people no matter what, are just trying to live and make it just like you and I.

Tex Taylor said...

Lex,

I respect the Sphinx for no other reason than he has obviously got a tough hide. That and no matter how much I must disagree with most of you here, I must admit I find all of you lefties interesting.

You know how it is. All of us need that occasional slap across the head to provoke some idea. When I come in here, it is if I can simply lift my right hand, spin a fast circle, and slap 20 heads at once.

P.S. - I was that stupid kid that threw dirt clods at the wasp nest and ran.

Sura 109 said...

Quoth the Head Lizardoid: "I predict that even if the Islamic world does see Obama as an apostate, if he’s elected president it will not be an issue."

So why are Chucky and his goose-stepping lizardoid minions making such a big deal of it?